Did Rei1,2,3 have souls ?

[EveAngel]

When Ritsuko destroyed Rei clones, she said they were just dummy plugs and shouldn't be considered as human because they had no soul .

It's widely stated that Rei holds the soul of lilith . Does that mean all three of Rei trio had soul of lilth ? How does Gendo put souls in Reis ?
What happens to the soul when Rei dies ?

Sorry too many question

[master_lloyd]

The soul of Lilith is transfered from Rei to Rei via an undisclosed 'salvaging' technique. Apparently the soul can be salvaged from the body after death.

[Mr. Tines]

You need a soul to have an AT field (as Kaworu explains).

The soul hangs around the corpus for a while as evidenced by the salvage of Kentucky Fried Rei in episode 23.

[master_lloyd]

You need a soul to have an AT field (as Kaworu explains).

The soul hangs around the corpus for a while as evidenced by the salvage of Kentucky Fried Rei in episode 23.

Dem's be sum finger-lickin' SOL

[Zuggy]

The soul of Lilith is transfered from Rei to Rei via an undisclosed 'salvaging' technique.

The salvaging process is disclosed in episode #20 when they attempt to salvage Shinji from 01, the process used in that episode is based off the data collected when they attempted to salvage Yui from the same Eva. Different circumstances for Rei sure, but the same technology is probably used in both cases - http://evageeks.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4267

You need a soul to have an AT field (as Kaworu explains).

Yet the soulless Rei vessels keep their form, as did the Evas before the contact experiments imparted a soul to them. There's a loophole in that somewhere for beings made from PWM.

[Ornette]

You need a soul to have an AT field (as Kaworu explains).

Yet the soulless Rei vessels keep their form, as did the Evas before the contact experiments imparted a soul to them. There's a loophole in that somewhere for beings made from PWM.

The Rei clones were in a tank, and Ritsuko was able to push a button and magically have them fall apart. What that means exactly is left up to speculation, but it's possible that the tank was keeping them intact.

As for Rei specifically:

Gendo:
There's no time... Your AT Field can no longer hold your shape.
Let's begin, Rei.

Seems to indicate that her ATF is holding her shape together.

[EveAngel]

Graaaa after reading replies Im even more confused

[Zuggy]

The Rei clones were in a tank, and Ritsuko was able to push a button and magically have them fall apart. What that means exactly is left up to speculation, but it's possible that the tank was keeping them intact.

It's possible. Seeing as they are all happy and whee (from the libinal energy) - the destrado stuff makes Shinji go pop in EoE as well, doesn't it?

Question then is if a body can survive without a soul purely on libinal energy (this comes into the salvage operations too), and what it's relation to PWM is (who knows, maybe they're the same thing).

Gendo:
There's no time... Your AT Field can no longer hold your shape.
Let's begin, Rei.

Seems to indicate that her ATF is holding her shape together.

That can't be applied to the soulless Rei vessels, unless you're implying Rei/Lilith's soul is split between the soulless Rei vessels, Lilith, and Eva-00 all at once and so it maintains all their shapes.

It's easier to classify everything made from PWM as not needing a soul to maintain it's shape as it covers all the Angel's corpses, the Adam sample, the Evas before their contact experiments, Lilith, and the Rei vessels prior to being implanted with Lilith's soul - instead of trying to come up with separate explanations, like the tank is maintaining the Rei vessels, for each case.

P.S. what the hell happened to your avatar.

[Ornette]

Gendo:
There's no time... Your AT Field can no longer hold your shape.
Let's begin, Rei.

Seems to indicate that her ATF is holding her shape together.

That can't be applied to the soulless Rei vessels, unless you're implying Rei/Lilith's soul is split between the soulless Rei vessels, Lilith, and Eva-00 all at once and so it maintains all their shapes.

I didn't mean to apply that to the clones. But sort of replying to a previous train of thought that involved Tines explaining that you need a soul to have an ATF. And if Rei didn't need a soul to hold her shape, why would Gendo mention that her ATF can no longer hold her shape? I am also suggesting the possiblity that Rei isn't made of any PWM at all. In both cases with the Tank and her ATF no longer holding her shape (if she had PWM magic to hold her shape, why is she falling apart?), could work without Rei having PWM magic.

[EveAngel]

PWM ?

[Ornette]

Sorry.

See here: http://evageeks.org/FGP/Particle_wave_matter

[Zuggy]

I didn't mean to apply that to the clones. But sort of replying to a previous train of thought that involved Tines explaining that you need a soul to have an ATF.

Ahh, ok, I thought this bit of your post was directly in response to me so I replied -

As for Rei specifically:

Gendo:
There's no time... Your AT Field can no longer hold your shape.
Let's begin, Rei.

Seems to indicate that her ATF is holding her shape together.

I am also suggesting the possiblity that Rei isn't made of any PWM at all. In both cases with the Tank and her ATF no longer holding her shape (if she had PWM magic to hold her shape, why is she falling apart?), could work without Rei having PWM magic.

But can you explain her regrowing her damned arm and teleporting and stuff like that? Then there's that shot in episode #4 of Rei's spectrum scan which to me suggests the spectrum scan of the Angel, which is on the very page of the Evapedia you linked to there. Then you have to explain how the bodies coming out of Lilith (which are logically the Rei clones) are not made from the same matter as Lilith.

Kaworu, who if Rei is made from PWM should logically be made from PWM as well, generates a strong AT field that none of the LCL-based life is shown to be able to do, Rei also generates a really strong AT field but we never see her do the lightworks that Kaworu does.

[Ornette]

But can you explain her regrowing her damned arm and teleporting and stuff like that? Then there's that shot in episode #4 of Rei's spectrum scan which to me suggests the spectrum scan of the Angel, which is on the very page of the Evapedia you linked to there. Then you have to explain how the bodies coming out of Lilith (which are logically the Rei clones) are not made from the same matter as Lilith.

This is all under the assumption that it's the PWM which allows this magic to happen, why not the soul? When we see her in EoE, does she magically have a body again that's made of PWM? The legs on Lilith could possibly be those of cloned Rei's but the RCB says Rei was a product of Yui's failed salvage operation. The spectrum on the scan, I didn't think has any significance other than to make it look more interesting, and possibly to allude to Rei's true origins. If in fact, the scan explicitly says anything about Rei being an Angel, would Ritsuko (who knows Rei's origins) be so calmly examining this with Misato sitting right there?

Kaworu, who if Rei is made from PWM should logically be made from PWM as well, generates a strong AT field that none of the LCL-based life is shown to be able to do, Rei also generates a really strong AT field but we never see her do the lightworks that Kaworu does.

If we're still under the assumption that ATF = Light of the soul -> soul generates the ATF, then I'm not sure what PWM has to do with the ATF.

[Reichu]

The legs on Lilith could possibly be those of cloned Rei's but the RCB says Rei was a product of Yui's failed salvage operation.

That only needs to apply to Rei 1, mind. The rest of them are clones.

If in fact, the scan explicitly says anything about Rei being an Angel, would Ritsuko (who knows Rei's origins) be so calmly examining this with Misato sitting right there?

From Misato's POV, the pretty rainbow colors could mean pretty much anything, no?

If we're still under the assumption that ATF = Light of the soul -> soul generates the ATF, then I'm not sure what PWM has to do with the ATF.

It gives you a badass ATF, presumably.

Yui (Lilin) --> Pathetic ATF
Yui (Eva) --> Do-whatever-the-shit-I-want ATF

[Eva Yojimbo]

It gives you a badass ATF, presumably.

Yui (Eva) --> Do-whatever-the-shit-I-want ATF

Surely that's as much a tribute to the S2 as the PWM. My theory is that PWM is rather like an all-purpose clay that can be shaped and used for various purposes. An S2 can generate energy that can restore PWM ore unleash it like a weapon (S2 energy + PWM = Sahaquiel body bomb). PWM sans S2 = lifeless clay.

However, everything deteriorates, so it's not out of the question that LCL sustains PWM in the absence of a soul. Ergo the Rei clones. They've been shaped through a cloning process, but the PWM can't hold its shape permanently, hence them being suspended in LCL. It could also be surmised that LCL acts as kind of pseudo-soul, hence the alive-ness of the empty vessel Rei clones and the "Destrudo" death sequence that.

As far as Rei in EoE, the best I can come up with is perhaps the idea that Rei's body has become so reliant on LCL and medication that even with a soul it can't sustain itself.

[Semisubtle]

The legs on Lilith could possibly be those of cloned Rei's but the RCB says Rei was a product of Yui's failed salvage operation.

That only needs to apply to Rei 1, mind. The rest of them are clones.

Clones of the original Rei, or taken from Lilith, you mean?

[V]

well you see the thing is....I took "yui's salvaged remains" to NOT mean "we took what LCL was left and poured it into a Yui-shape to make Rei 1"....and just "we recovered genetic samples from the LCL of her contact experiment and cloned Rei 1 from it"

[Eva Yojimbo]

V, remember when Shinji was spit out of Sho in ep. 20? Remember when he disappeared inside the entry plug and only his LCL was left behind and they tried to anchor his soul and reconstruct the LCL to form his body? Well, imagine them doing the same with Yui, except Lilith's soul is sucked into the process and out pops Rei instead of Yui - a combination of Lilith's soul and Yui's LCL/DNA. Theoretically it could've happened almost precisely as it did in ep. 20 except for the whole Lilith soul sucking thing, which might be attributed to the image we see of Lilith and Sho linked together. It's likely Rei 1 was a complete accident.

[Semisubtle]

Theoretically it could've happened almost precisely as it did in ep. 20 except for the whole Lilith soul sucking thing, which might be attributed to the image we see of Lilith and Sho linked together. It's likely Rei 1 was a complete accident.

I thought that Lilith/Eva 01 picture was showing how the Eva was made from Lilith. Would they have had reason to link Lilith to Eva 01 like that if all they were doing was a Contact Experiment?

I do like the idea of Rei being an accident, but I'm not convinced her creation came from Yui's CE.

[Eva Yojimbo]

I thought that Lilith/Eva 01 picture was showing how the Eva was made from Lilith. Would they have had reason to link Lilith to Eva 01 like that if all they were doing was a Contact Experiment?

I do like the idea of Rei being an accident, but I'm not convinced her creation came from Yui's CE.

Former: It was, but if we are to go with "Rei born from the attempted Yui Salvage" theory, I have no clue as to how Lilith's soul could've gotten into the mix if it didn't have something to do with when Lilith was linked to Sho.

Latter: Not from the CE directly but from the attempted salvage. I think it's the best theory we've currently got, because there's no evidence to support anything else AFAIK.